Using the deeply scientific formula of more engine = more better, Piper followed the muscle car trend and threw eight cylinders under the hood. A turbonormalized version of the Comanche C was offered alongside the normally aspirated model in 1970. The all-metal Comanches, with their laminar-flow wings, retractable landing gear, stabilators, and greater interior comfort than any previous Piper, made the aircraft a serious competitor. Think sports sedan, not track toy. $950.00. Theres plenty of instrument panel real estate to pretty much do whatever you can afford. Sold out. With a Comanche expert doing the maintenance, these systems have been trouble-free for me, but not cheap. For an annual policy with $1,000,000 in liability only coverage.Premium range for qualified pilots: $345-$495 per year.Premium range for less than qualified pilots (low-time/etc): $525-$730 per year. In his description, he mentioned moving his gear selector to "neutral" for flight?? Their excellent build quality with total corrosion proofing before assembly and compound curve panels meant that the underlying cost structure was greater than emerging designs from either Piper or its competitors. The motor can be pulled, disassembled, cleaned, reassembled, and tested with not too much hassle in a day by an AME. It lands safely and usually smoothly, with the correct speed and an exaggerated flare. The Comanche line debuted in 1958, with the Comanche 180 and 250 models. An aircraft with a turbocharged engine is likely to cost about $500 more, and some Comanche 250s sell for as much as $74,000. With practice and with the gear down, finals for a precision approach can be flown at 130 knots and, with the gear up, even faster. The airplane also gained cowl flaps and an aileron-rudder interconnect. Note that I may need to charge for additional resources. The extra 10 GPH the big-engined Comanche 400 burns yields only about 10 to 15 extra knots. The trick-as it is with any older aircraft-is finding a shop or technician experienced in the type. The engine is reliable, smooth, easy to start and well supported.. You may also bookmark the NOTICE post which I will also be updating. The Rajay system essentially had a second throttle wastegate control the pilot used to manually set boost at altitude. The Comanches have a speed wing so its not a comfortable ride in moderate or greater turbulence, so slowing it down softens the bumps. Just for reference, Dukes guesstimated between $7,000 and $8,000, but that was more than 15 years ago for the sub-assembly P/N 25720-002 pictured above, which is without the release arm components, motor, or brake asm. The Comanche singles brought Piper into the modern era. Comanche Landing Ge. Piper PA24-250 Left maing gear side brace fitting PN 20760-00. For sure, the Comanches list of mods, modifiers and parts resources is long and best accessed from involvement with the ICS and its members and publications. PA-24 Comanche aircrafts pdf manual download. Ive taken the course twice. The AD list is pretty long, but most of the items are one-time fixes, followed by future inspection. Before 1958, Piper built its reputation on slow tube-and-fabric airplanes with cutesy names and pre-World War II design philosophies. The installation included dual Garmin G5 digital flight instruments, a PMA450 audio system, Garmin GTN 650 WAAS/GPS navigator and a GNC 255A VHF radio. 2020-06-26. There are mixed reviews from owners on maintaining a Comanche. The typical failure mode of the flap and landing gear motors is the insulation of the copper magnet wire windings in both the fields and armatures. We know of one flight school that had a Comanche on its flight line and it required renters to perform gear extensions and retractions with the airplane on jack stands. A few pumps of the primer, throttle in slightly, key to start, and the carbureted flat six comes to life with a lightly muffled, big bore growl. At the time, Pipers most successful aircraft was the Cub, a wood and fabric taildragger with 65 HP and a blazing maximum cruise of 85 mph. Answer: It should not be too difficult. But as the motor keeps getting weaker due to a dirty commutator/brushes/windings, it will take less and less increased force to jam it. The most common seem to be brake lines jamming and old conduits. Subsequent Comanche models both single- and twin-engine were built until 1972. Come join us! It was also the only light civil aircraft to come with four, six, and eight-cylinder options from the factory. You can modify its engine, its look, its handling, its panel and its features. The ICS is extremely resourceful, with a list of qualified instructors and shops familiar with the airplane. * Please DO NOT ship any items to be serviced to any of his addresses. There would have been a happy ending, but he stalled the airplane on short final, over the runway, and stuck a wingtip into the ground. We think at least two of those pilots did change to a tank with fuel, but didnt wait long enough for it to fill the empty fuel lines between the selector and the engine before concluding that the new tank was dry as well and switching into another empty tank (or the original tank). All of my transmissions are supplied with new gears, new bearings, and a new ball screw assembly. Four of those involved inflight breakups-the clean Comanche airframe will smoke through Vne in short order once the nose is down or in a diving spiral. As one of Piper's first all-metal, ultra-aerodynamic airplanes furnished with a comfortable interior, it helped differentiate the company from its early style of slower tube-and-fabric aircraft. This non-FAA overhauled [owner produced] unit is the problem-solver. If yours requires a lengthy diagnosis I can create a solution-tree for you; sometimes accompanied by a color-coded wiring diagrammatic solution. All rights reserved. An insulation tester is required to analyze the copper magnet wire insulation condition. Some years ago, there was some thought given to resurrecting the design at the hands of the legendary and brilliant Roy LoPresti, but like the Swift Fury, it came to nothing. There is also a Piper Owner Society, which you can find at https://piperowner.org/. While Comanche engines are generally dependable, beware of top-end overhauls that were accomplished without replacing the cylinders with new ones. Also installed was a new glare- shield and a metal panel. I was 63 years old when I got my pilot license. The airplane is a four-place, low wing, single engine airplane equipped with retractable tricycle landing gear. For more than five decades, active and dedicated aircraft owners and pilots have turned to AVIATION CONSUMER to answer their most important buying questions. By the time these models were introduced, the Comanches production run was about to end without warning, so this variant is comparatively rare. Visit the FAA website for the most-accurate information. It also had a spacious and aerodynamic four-seat cabin and a weak 180 HP four-cylinder engine. We do not guarantee this is up-to-date. Other than the heat. Roll and pitch controls have good harmony, with a moderate force, and almost no rudder needed to coordinate turns. After years of distance-traveling in my airplane (to places I never would have visited if it werent for my Comanche), I believe a full-featured autopilot is perhaps the most useful avionics system you can buy. The airplane is approved for day and night VFR/IFR operations when equipped in accordance with F.A.R. Kudos to them-we think every retrac pilot should witness a gear swing on the appropriate model. Apart from the aforementioned ADs, Comanches are unremarkable; most other ADs are minor and/or shotgun directives that apply to many airplanes. What I thought was a normal flare attitude resulted in bouncing the nosewheel, then the mains on the first try. Parts are primarily through boutique suppliers and rarely a problem to source. Piper PA24-250 nose gear landing fork PN 20790-00. Ask someone about the Piper Comanche series and youre likely to get a comment along the lines of with that laminar-flow wing and low ground clearance, its a mutha to land-you float and float in ground effect, then it pays off and wham! Aside from the engine and prop, it involves the engine mounts, some baffling, controls and the exhaust system. We did not find evidence that the Comanche has peculiar landing characteristics-there were only six hard landing events, well below what we would expect for an airplane that is truly difficult to land. Products (www.aviationperformanceproducts.com), which claims that its Eagle XP cowling increases speed, economy and improves maintenance access. Considering these old motors have performed countless cycles, with 50 and some up to 70 years in service, in my opinion why ask another lifetime from one of them. In 1961, the gross weight of the 250 was boosted by 100 pounds. In 1966, the Comanche B, with a fuel-injected 260-HP Lycoming IO-540-D4A5, a boosted gross weight (now 3100 pounds) and two more seats, was added to the lineup, starting with serial number 24-4300. In my opinion, there is no reason to own a 180 Comanche unless you are consumed with fuel range and can tolerate the vibration from the engine being so far out from the firewall. But your best bet would be to try both and see which you prefer. Official FAA overhaul language would apply if there was stated criteria, and the agency was FAA approved. We may earn a commission from links on this page. The only major issues have been a nosegear door repair and re-rigging the trim cable. Landing Gear Strut Service Filler Adapter (90 Degree). There is a Piper Comanche group on Facebook, which describes itself as THE group for those of us who love Piper Comanches. No, a Piper Comanche didn't look like Mr. Piper but they did share personality traits because in those days folks created airplanes in their own image. Fuel Burn at 75% power in standard conditions per hour. Speaking of ICS, owners tell us the group is an exceptionally good resource for Comanche owners. My hardest transition in flying the Comanche was planning enough time to slow it up to the gear extension speed of 150 MPH and managing four fuel tanks (90 gallons total) and an electric fuel pump (on and off for landing and takeoffs). My first and only aircraft has been my Comanche 250, which spent most of its life in Texas. It's important to remember that Comanches are slippery. Plus, it can be well-maintained at a lower cost than aircraft of lesser performance due to the widespread use of generic parts. Trailer Landing Gear - S2000 Plus Mega(id:11290677), View quality Commercial vehicles, Truck details from Haacon Hebetechnik Gmbh storefront on EC21.com. After multiple failures and mistakes on their part, I pursued my own approach. There are no up locks in the system. Forcing the aircraft on to the ground may be tempting, but it causes even more problems, and it is important to make sure you are at the correct attitude and airspeed as soon as you land. In 1958 it released the Comanche 250. Answer: it really comes down to personal preference. Since all Piper Comanches are now second hand, prices can vary immensely depending on age, model, condition, and sometimes just the luck of the draw! During normal operation the fuel is drawn to the engine from the cells by a mechanically operated fuel pump located on the engine accessory section. Dialling codes. The 180 Comanches load-carrying capacity is ample but modest. Install your motor and brake and youre back in business. This field is for validation purposes and should be left unchanged. The added seats are in the baggage compartment. https://www.aviationconsumer.com/used-aircraft-guide/piper-comanche-2/, https://www.aopa.org/go-fly/aircraft-and-ownership/aircraft-fact-sheets/piper-comanche, https://aerocorner.com/aircraft/piper-pa-24-comanche/, https://bwifly.com/piper-comanche-insurance-cost/, Bombardier Challenger 300 Guide and Specs. Make sure the brake is making good physical contact and has the rubber rub surface in place. LoPresti did create some interesting and worthwhile aerodynamic mods for the airplane, however. It is a four cylinder, normally aspirated, direct drive, air cooled, horizontally opposed, carburetor equipped engine. If you land even a little too fast, the airplane tends to float and float, while the speed slowly bleeds off. We may earn a commission from links on this page. As one result, many have opted to replace their old Hartzells for new two- or three-blade Hartzell or McCauley propellers, which terminates the AD. "Keep it above 5 feet and don't do nuthin dumb!". Piper designed and built the aircraft from 1956 until 1972, when the manufacturing plant was wiped out by a massive flood and production ceased. Piper kept the Comanche's electromechanical manual landing gear relatively simple, although it can be a source of woes when not maintained properly. Also, the landing gear is built tough. Browse through Piper-related FAA announcements, service bulletins, NPRMs and more on this page. Quad Ring, Main Gear Strut, Piper Fixed Gear. Other similar aircraft are the Cessna 172, and also the Grumman AA-5 series and Beechcraft Musketeer, although none of these are retractables and they are significantly slower. Someone else might be having similar questions. Buy best Trailer Landing Gear - S2000 Plus Mega with escrow buyer protection. Also be sure the circuit breaker is the correct amperage (I believe 30 amps, but check it out in the manual). A prop inspection (AD 2005-18-12) is the most oft-complained about, costing nearly $1000 every 500 hours or five years. Not a rocket by any means, but not bad for the conditions. Capacity of these cells, which are classified as the main fuel cells, is 30 gallons each. You might hear some say the Comanche is tough to land smoothly, and that it floats when in the flare, and then drops on. In the normal category all aerobatic maneuvers including spins are prohibited. Cookie information is stored in your browser and performs functions such as recognising you when you return to our website and helping our team to understand which sections of the website you find most interesting and useful. He is in the process of recovering. However, it is important to know that Comanches are very responsive.or some might say they are slippery or twitchy. While youre busy fighting one snake in the cockpit, you notice the nice airflow from earlier has nearly died off, and the smallish windows mean you lose sight of the runway turning downwind. I have done my best to write helpful and technically descriptive articles, to save everyone time and aggravation. The Piper PA-24 Comanche is a single-engined, low wing, all-metal light aircraft, with retractable landing gear and either four or six seats. Recurring ADs on any aircraft can run up the cost of operation, and Comanches are no different. A brief overview of the Dura landing gear transmission in a Piper Comanche Speeds are up around 155 to 160 knots at cruise, burning about 12 GPH. With the primitive indicating systems associated with many of the airplanes in the field, too often a pilot is faced with the dilemma, Now where did I put that fuel?. We fact-checked as best we could, at any rate. Note that you generally can't load the motor enough at the wheels as all the mechanical leverage is in the motor's favor there. But you will need quite a lot of extra training and practice, as the Commanche is much bigger than the two-seater Tomahawk, and also much faster. Matt suffered a heart attack which required open heart surgery back on May 20th, 2023. FWIW I have every component to repair the Dukes transmissions; all of my new transmissions use the latest Dukes specification gears set, not the original steel version. Once in the pilot seat, you notice that nose-up attitude and long cowl restricts your forward field of view somewhat while on the ground. There were eight runway loss of control incidents, low, we think-and one of them involved a student pilot. Our research tends to find that this is indeed the case. Initial climb was right around 1,000 feet per minute with the gear up. Strictly Necessary Cookie should be enabled at all times so that we can save your preferences for cookie settings. Comanche 250s sold like hot cakes. The same goes for the interior, obviously, although weve seen some Comanches decked out with some pretty nice and modern custom leather seating and trim. Visit our. Start your free trial today! There were eight LOC events in IMC or dark night conditions.
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